Brentwood Paramedic Drives Ambulance to Daughter's Volleyball Game, Prompts Public Safety Committee Discussion
Alderman Anthony Harper doesn't like city vehicles used for a personal use.
A Brentwood paramedic used a city ambulance to go watch his daughter play volleyball at St. Mary Magdalen, alderman and Public Safety Committee member Anthony Harper said.
The Public Safety Committee discussed firefighters and police officers using city vehicles to go to sporting events, QuikTrip, a drive-through or home, as a result of that use of a city vehicle, at their meeting on Thursday.
Human Resources Manager Julie Echols said when the committee determines what qualifies as an approved city event, then a policy can be written. She said it’s covered in the handbook now, but it’s vague.
She researched other communities, and said Frontenac and Clayton encourage their crews to go out and participate in community events.
Harper agreed that community events are OK for the use of city vehicles.
“This was being used for a personal event, not a community event,” he said. “That’s the difference, there’s a clear distinction.”
Committee member, Alderman Tom Kramer asked Fire Chief Ted Jury his opinion, and Jury declined.
“This is just the way business is done here,” he said. “The fire department, police department always attended events like this in various different forms.”
Brentwood Police Chief Steve Disbennett said anytime officers are in the community they’re representing the city, and are being watched.
“The citizens, they’re the ones that are going to tell me that they didn’t think it was right that a police officer was in a place in town where they shouldn’t be,” he said.
He said the police department addresses incidents like this on an individual basis. There’s no set policy.
Kramer asked, if an officer goes to a drive-through, or home to get something, does he log in with the dispatcher to say he’s out of service, or is he always in service?
Disbennett said only a few officers live in town, and they’re the only ones allowed to go home, or others can make a quick in-town trip. He said otherwise, they log out for personal time. He said the department has to know where they are all the time.
“It’s a fine line,” Disbennett said. “They’re out of service, but in service. They’re never really out of service, because if an emergency occurred, I don’t care if you’re eating, that has to be dropped.”
Kramer said a police officer at a soccer game, who is still in service, still has a radio on, and close to his vehicle where he could respond in a quickly, is different than someone not paying attention, and not able to respond quickly to an emergency.
“I hear what Alderman Harper is saying,” Kramer said, “but we don’t want our emergency safety employees to be so constrained, that they cannot be in different parts of the city where they may know the people involved.”
Kramer said he’s in favor of an officer or firefighter at an event with a city vehicle if he or she can still respond to an emergency, if not, he’s against it.
Alderman Lee Wynn, the chairman of the committee, said a vehicle should be easily available if it’s at a sporting event. He also said Harper made a good point.
“I think we should be very careful about allowing vehicles to be used that way,” he said. “There’s a difference between a city function and a personal function.”
The entire committee wasn’t there, and Wynn said they should wait for a full committee to make any decision.
jen bryant
8:37 am on Saturday, November 17, 2012
The Brentwood community is so fortunate to have such a high quality team of police, paramedics and firemen. I needed them yesterday and I am forever impressed. They are really never off duty. A school volleyball game is not a conflict of interest. Please pick on something else.
Marla J. Logan
8:45 am on Saturday, November 17, 2012
Thank you for this information, I work closely with the Brentwood Police and Fire departments with our National Night Out event to bond community and emergency personnel, and feel this is a perfect example to bring those two groups together. We need to see our Police, Fire, Ambulance workers as the family they are, to us as residents. I believe this opens the door to communication and comfort if there is a need for their services, we are not afraid or intimidated to ask for help. I would love to see more of this.
Marla J. Logan
Brandon Jones
8:53 am on Saturday, November 17, 2012
A school volleyball game IS a community event. The WHOLE community doesn't show up to Brentwood days either. Although not mentioned in the article, I'm sure he had his partner with him, so they were ready and able to respond to an emergency. Leave the medic alone. If he is fired over this, I will do everything in my power, organize every person I can, to see you out of office, Mr. Harper. The BOA needs to focus on fixing itself before going after other. It's kind of a pot calling the kettle black kind of thing, isn't it?
Kay Scott-Boyd
1:18 pm on Saturday, November 17, 2012
If I remember correctly Anthony Harper has only been on the BOA for a short time. I am sure he is just trying to help get Brentwood's ducks in a row. I personally think the better use of our tax dollars is to put more police on the streets rather than give all of the staff a 3% increase in salary. sorry guys but I worked for the State for a long time where we never got a raise. Reality is if we are short of money, then staff should not get pay increases.
hogansgoat
8:54 am on Saturday, November 17, 2012
The police and firefighters work long shifts 365 days a year and 7 days a week always there when we need them .There is nothing wrong with the police or firefighters attending some type of event in town .that persons daughter just happened to be playing a game at a brentwood location ,I bet you anything they would not of gone out of town to see the game because it is not allowed and the police and fireman all do their job to the max and live by the rules of their department. Thank You
Thomas Gibson
9:03 am on Saturday, November 17, 2012
Yeah, come up with something important to worry about! He was on duty and ready to respond if someone needed him. I have and my dad has in the past and they do a great job of helping us all out. worry about the big stuff not the small stuff harper.
Julie Nelson
9:34 am on Saturday, November 17, 2012
I think Mr. Harper's point is that these city vehicles are expensive to operate and should only be used on official business.
Julie Nelson
Brandon Jones
10:19 am on Saturday, November 17, 2012
The "operational" cost you hear about for an ambulance is the budget for the whole year divided by how many runs they do. The actual operational cost is just the deseil fuel to get 4 blocks from the firehouse to St. Mary Magdalen and back. Granted the ambulances get pretty crappy gas mileage, but we are still on talking a a dollar or so.
From a former EMT.
Aimee Granneman
9:21 pm on Saturday, November 17, 2012
I can't believe this is even an issue. As a Brentwood resident and a parent of a child whom attends St. Mary Magdalen, any and all employees of the Police or Fire Deparment should be thanked every time they are out and about in The City of Brentwood. How is this any different than the firemen patronizing our local groceries. I've seen them leave carts to rush out the door. Hiding away in a building until they are needed certainly doesn't do any good. Having them out and about with the possibility of never knowing when one might "pop in" somewhere in Brentwood seems like better crime prevention, etc. to me. As for "waste of city tax dollars"? Anyone whom thinks these men and women whom put their lives on the line daily are being compensated for their worth monetarily in a fair manor, needs their head examined. This being said, call it a "perk" of living in the municipality in which they work. The employees at Macy's get a discount on merchandise, consider this a comparable and be done with it. The real waste of tax payers money will be when work time is taken to even discuss this nonsense in City Hall next week.
TOOWARM
6:43 am on Sunday, November 18, 2012
Yes, we should be thanking them... We do this by giving them a very good wage that by todays standards is surpassing the private sector, we thank them by giving them a pension unheard of today in the private sector. Todays "public servants" are becoming tomorrows "public privileged".
Sean Dooley
8:04 pm on Sunday, November 18, 2012
And part of the job is to be out in the public eye. You are lucky to have Firefighter/medics that live in your community, as opposed to a bunch of people who don't live in the community, make their paycheck for "being kept in a firehouse", and leave to go back to their welcoming community.
Donna Neal
8:30 pm on Sunday, November 18, 2012
I think someone should be policing the fire, police and other city officials of Brentwood. Seems as though the above stated feel they can do anything they want, remember, the citizens pay the cost. Keep personal business personal, not in company vehicles. Maybe someone should be watching the mayor, I'm not sure he isn't behind some of these things that go on in Brentwood.
Mr. Completely
5:48 am on Monday, November 19, 2012
The headline here should be: Brentwood Citizens Have Lost Trust In Their City Government. That’s what is going on here. Do you really think that Jane/Joe average Brentwoodian really cares about some 1st responder driving his duty vehicle to a sport event that his kid is participating in? Please.
Bentwood has lost the trust and respect of its people and it will continue until the usual suspects at city hall have been replaced by popular vote.
Bob Earthal
1:48 pm on Monday, November 19, 2012
Thank you, Mr. Harper for raising this issue and asking the appropriate questions. While this appears to be nothing more than an innocent activity with the upside of good parenting and a paramedic (or 2) at a sporting event, it should be given proper review. Given the recent revelations of institutionalized theft, fraud and corruption in our city government, it would be irresponsible not to do so. (And a simple review doesn't mean anyone has been accused of anything.) I also like the comments of Chief Disbennett, that decisions on this type of activity are made on a case-by-case basis in his department. Department leaders should have the room to exercise judgement in these matters knowing that they are subject to periodic review. One-size-fits-all policies that administrators are fond of, generally fit no one.
Jim Schmuke
2:40 pm on Monday, November 19, 2012
This is really a non issue folks. He drove to STMM. (.45 miles from fire station to STMM.) He didn't drive to Chesterfield or Affton or Maryland Heights.
Smileyrie
1:16 pm on Wednesday, November 28, 2012
As Paramedics we don't need to be sitting at a station waiting for a call because we have to go to where the jobs are & never know where the job will be. We have a mobile workplace - our vehicle. We're always ready to respond to an emergency no matter where we are as long as we're in our area. And a venue which is very likely to require an ambulance is a sporting event, so being there to start will save time in response.
Tony
3:16 pm on Wednesday, November 28, 2012
Hey toowarm I like how you can't even put your real name and you put a comment like that. Really a pension? So we are not worth paying right now what were worth? That pension you speak of is not what is breaking communities my pension is still not enough to retire off of alone oh wait they don't tell you that they just say that we are breaking the us. Look around brother politicians who want more money for themselves are telling you all this garbage. Do even know what it's like to do CPR on a little girl that had been dead for hours but you do everything you can just because. Do you know what it's like to tell someone there family member is dead? Do you know what it's like to not eat for more that 24hrs because your running your butt off? Do you know what it's like to be at your daughters sporting event watching a game while your off duty then get called in because someone else's emergent needs you? No you don't I'm sure of it with a cornment like that so take your public privleadge comment and stick it were the sun don't shine!
Jamie L
11:32 am on Thursday, November 29, 2012
Amen Tony! Its people like TooWarm who still call us "ambulance drivers" and really have no clue what its like to be called out at all hours of the day and night. To not have a regular sleeping or eating schedule. To risk our lives to save anothers with out any thought.
Jake Stein
3:28 pm on Wednesday, November 28, 2012
Considered a fire truck get 2 mpg for gas and an ambulance might get 6 - 10, when you have several vehicles running around town on personal errands, it adds up. Even small communities can rack up a $500,000 fuel bill easily and this must be paid by the public with tax increases. No other places of employment allows their employees to just leave work and attend a ballgame. That includes healthcare workers who are expected to stay with the patients 12 hours a day. It is not like the Paramedics and firefighers don't have things to do at their stations like sleep, play on the computer, cook and entertain guests. Some even may even be allowed alcohol while on duty if they work 12 or 24 hour shifts. And, they are all paid to sleep on duty even if just a 12 hour shift.
Jamie L
2:46 pm on Thursday, November 29, 2012
So Jake are you saying that when we work our 24 hour shift and would like to eat. That we park our truck at the station, "punch out" drive our personal vehicle to that oh so great fast food joint, get our meal and then drive back to the station to eat, or maybe take that hour break that so many get on their 9-5 job and stay at the restaurant? So then what happens when your family member goes into cardiac arrest during my meal hour, our your child runs our in front of that speeding vehicle as they chased their ball, our drowned in that pool you dont have a fence around, and Im not in my truck that I could have taken to lunch with me, and I have to drive back to the station and get my ambulance so that I then can respond to your family members emergency, hmm just ate away their last 6 minutes of oxygen reserves. And hospital workers are allowed breaks, and I dont know what ambulance or fire service that you are referring too that get to drink while on duty. And yes we are paid to sleep on duty even for those 12 hours shifts because when we are awakened at 3am for that family member who needs someone who is trained to save them would probably like someone who is fresh and has a clear mind, so yes we are paid to sleep on the job. Sure beats running the ambulance into the ditch because we are too tired to keep it on the road.
Nick
3:51 pm on Wednesday, November 28, 2012
It is certainly clear which commentators have worked in this field and which ones are just morons commenting about something they know nothing about. I will give up my pension, stay at the firehouse and not sleep during my 24hrpension shift but it in return, I get a meal break every 8 hours so you better find someone to cover those so i can do errands and eat, I get an option if I want to come in for hire back (yep, you can no longer send a deputy to my door to force me in) and if i dont get my pension, you dont get your unemployment, I wreck my body for my paycheck.
SC_Medic
7:12 pm on Wednesday, November 28, 2012
What I've been taught throughout the years is that when you're on duty and you want to attend an event like a volleyball game, You are showing support for that organzation. It says alot by doing things like this to the community. This type of appearence shows that you as a person care.
TOOWARM
12:04 pm on Thursday, November 29, 2012
Ouch....
Pam Griesemer
1:01 pm on Friday, November 30, 2012
I love seeing our guys out and about and part of the community. Please let them continue to attend kids games etc...
Shawna Tabert
8:50 am on Sunday, December 2, 2012
I work in the field and find the publics lack of understanding of the job sad. It is not like the tv series, thank you. We get paid poor wages to save lives. What is your life worth? Your childs? I bet it is not an hourly rate. We drop everything at the sound of siren and rush to your "emergency". I am a supervisor and here is my policy......If you are not outside of our coverage area, it is not an issue. If it does not affect your response time, it is not an issue. If you are not putting the organization in a bad light, it is not an issue. Family is just as important to us as it is to you. After all you did want a quick response to your 911 call. You did want a kind, courteous, skilled, and attentive care. Our job is different in everyway from your 9-5. My bad day....people die. Don't comment on things you have experience or understanding of.
To all those who miss holidays, family dinners, anniversaries, birthdays, sports games, etc..Thank you for all you have done, and continue to do!
Jake Stein
9:59 pm on Sunday, December 2, 2012
Nobody made you become an EMT. Working 24 hour shifts should have been left in the 1970s. It is dangerous, stupid and a waste of taxpayer money. The saving lives statements you keep making to get a free lunch gives all of us in EMS a black eye. There are many, many people involved in saving a person's life. You are NOT a doctor.
If you wanted to have dinner with the family, you should never have gotten into EMS or any other health care profession. RNs works 12 hours shifts and sometimes 16 without the ability to just leave the hospital to see a volleyball game. They must care for many patients at one time. They also don't get to sleep 12 of 24 hours and play on the computer, watch movies and drive around in an ambulance looking for a place to eat which will give them a free meal if they play the hero card.
It seems some here are very young and still believe the world owes them somethings. I would be those who say "it's all about the community" are actually saying "screw the taxpayers, I'm going and no one is going to stop me".
BTW, I like the 6 digit income I have as a FF/Paramedic. I don't consider that a poor wage but if you want to give me a raise at the expense of taxpayers, I'll take it. Face it, we've got it made with a fantastic pension plan and even a gym at the station. I also can ride around town all day in an expensive truck but some of us do own homes and pay taxes so we do have a little better understanding than the typical 19 y/o Paramedic.
Jim Schmuke
10:22 pm on Sunday, December 2, 2012
I'm a little confused. Jake Stein, are you a FF/Paramedic or an EMT or none of the above. I can't tell from your comments if you are ticked at FF/Paramedics, on the side of them, or don't know what you want. My father was a firefighter for more than 20 years and I get a little testy when people start bashing them. Thankfully he was only hurt on the job once or twice, but there was always the chance he may have never come home.
Jake Stein
6:50 am on Monday, December 3, 2012
I get a little testy when some Paramedics and firefighters are constantly playing the hero card just like you "with they may not come home". Alot of occupations are dangerous. Working in a convenience store on the nightshift is probably more dangerous. Driving a car is dangerous. Always wanting something and feeling entitled to everything are what gives some in EMS and the FD a bad name. If you can not accept the risks, then that profession is not for you whether it is EMS, FD, coal mining or construction. There are many, many more kiled working construction than firefighting or EMS. One of the reasons firefighters train is so they don't get hurt.
I like the benefits the fire department has to offer and I hate it when some fools try to ruin it for their own objectives. That can ruin things for the rest of us. If this Paramedic has actually been doing a community service or if he had not already had a habit of taking the truck to where ever he feels, this might not have made national or international news. Now at least other countries which have stricter professional standards for their Paramedics can get another laugh at US EMS and FD.
Jim Schmuke
11:53 am on Monday, December 3, 2012
Actually my dad never thought of himself as a hero. He just went about his job every day he walked in the fire station. You never answered the question of whether you're a FF/paramedic/EMT etc., It doesn't really matter,but it seems you have an issue with the whole profession. If you are I appreciate the job you do. But your comments are confusing.
Jake Stein
1:52 pm on Monday, December 3, 2012
Seriously Jim? Did you not bother to read any of my posts before typing? I commented on my job, title and salary. From your "life saving and death on the job comments, I would put you at about 19 y/o. Your father might be old enough to be from my generation where we were proud to do the job and did not feel like everyone owed us a parade just for the title. I do take issue with what the "me and only me" generation has done to the profession. I have been around long enough to respect alot of professions which are dangerous because sometimes their have to call us to get their dead out of some machinery or see what is left after a fall from a high rise which they have been working on. I also don't envy the power company employees who were working 16 hours straight during the storms while back at the station we were bitching about when the cable/electricity was going to be back in service so we could watch TV and play on the computer.
So get over it Jim. To most in the FD today, they go to the coffee houses, grocery stores, movies, the beach and ballgames because they are entitled to do as they wish and not because of community service. Not many left in the FD who believe in service to the public and for the good of the community.
Jim Schmuke
5:02 pm on Monday, December 3, 2012
You are wrong by a long shot. I'm not going to comment any further on your senseless garbage. I hope I'm never in a situation that I have to depend on you. Sad.