I recently moved into maplewood, i use to live in richmond heights been in the area for over 25 years.I think it's real funny that everybody has blinders on .you're okay with cvs on 1 corner thinkin that nobody is going to skip class and run over there .which now you have to cross that intersection .just hang out there during school time . And see how many kids run over to that liquor store and ochinese restaurant rather is right or wrong for quick trip to be there don't be so one sided about the situation .plus this would be the second time that quick trip got screwed over by maplewood & plus the city council .if you recall you need the tax dollars from the big bad walmart .so look around you before your so judgemental about quiktrip . Mike

mike, while some opponents of the move have voiced concern about students skipping class and using QT as a place to hang out, there is much greater concern about pedestrian safety and the impact this will have on traffic coming in and out of the school and the surrounding neighborhood. Much of this concern is due to the fact that this plan incorporates Martini Drive into QT's parking lot, which will then see hundreds of cars per hour through it as students are walking to and from class. Many of the opponents to this plan I have spoken to personally don't have a problem at all with QT - they have a problem with this particular development plan. We're calling on the city, the school board, and any prospective tenants to do a better job of working together and coming up with a plan that doesn't compromise on safety or access to the school and neighborhood.

While taking my trash to the curb this morning, I noticed a young girl riding down the street on her bicycle on her way to the high school. She was riding uncomfortably, with a backpack and a shoulder-slung book bag, listening to an MP3 player. Her tires were low on air and she was wobbling back and forth as she rode, perhaps because the low pressure made the bike hard to pedal and control. She was not wearing a helmet.
In addition to pedestrians, she is the kind of young person who is on the streets and crossing intersections in the vicinity of the high school. She was making a lot of mistakes, but doesn't deserve to be struck by a car or killed because of them.
This huge new high traffic facility should not be added to that already busy intersection.
If they think about it, from any perspective other than a blue-sky bottom-line revenue forecast, I can't see how building this facility makes sense even to QuikTrip, much less to the city.

Mike, I completely understand the need for economic growth in Maplewood, but I would rather see that growth come from more residents moving to the city because of an absolutely awesome school district than from putting a QT that close to the high school. Allowing this type of car-centric business to be put that close to the high school is seriously only increasing the likelihood of negative pedestrian and car situations, which in turn reflects poorly on the school district. The corner in question can easily be developed by another company with a not-so-car-centric business, so it's not like the city is killing all future opportunities at economic development.

Besides, there is more to building a great community AND SCHOOL DISTRICT than jumping at every business opportunity that presents itself. I, for one, consider a pedestrian friendly community much more valuable to the community than the revenue from ONE business.

QuikTrip has been a responsible business in our city and neighborhood. They took safety concerns into account when they first proposed building their facility many years ago by conferring with city officials and nearby residents. They closed off access to Elm Street from their parking lot to avoid cut through traffic resulting in a safer street for residents. The business site is always clean and well kept and has been a real asset to Maplewood. I am confident they would maintain their business site if they are allowed to buildi at Big Bend and Manchester. Safety is always a cncern for all age groups, especially children. I believe that QuikTrip has addressed this important issue by offering to pay for a crosswalk guard. Perhaps the Maplewood police could assist in some capacity to provide additional safety measures. In addition, I understand the design of the site would allow for more visibility of traffic for drivers as well as pedestrians. Is a school bus a viable option for school children? If not, parents with safety concerns should take personal responsiblity for their children by walking or driving them to school.

Has any other viable business expressed interest in building on the site in question? If not, than Maplewood residents and city officials need to seriously consider the building proposal of QuikTrip. The city needs the income and QuikTrip has earned it's reputation as a responsible and good business neighbor.

If it was up to all these nay sayers, we wouldnt have gotten out of the dark ages, your parents said the same thing when the scooter and car lots first came here, didnt do anything then and wont now, doesnt take a moron to understand progress!!!

What about building a pedestrian bridge over traffic or develop some other arrangement to make crossings safe for everyone? The bridge might be an expensive idea, but maybe someone has a better idea.

Keith, thank you for elevating the conversation with name calling. As previously stated, many of those who oppose this plan are not saying a QT cannot go there, but the plan that has been presented has problems that need to be addressed.

I doubt I'll change any minds here but perhaps can show that us "nay sayers" are reasonable, informed and not moronic. Using Quick Trip's numbers from their traffic study which is all we have to go on they say there will be 585 trips into/out of the site during peak AM hour. 1/3 of those trips or 194 will be via the Martini entrance...again QT's estimates. The "study" does not estimate how many will travel north on Martini. So imagine you are making one of those 194 trips and you want to go left on Martini to go west on Manchester. You have carefully settled your coffee in your holder, put you phone away after texting your boss that you are running late and now there's a crossing guard stopping the flow. Perhaps you patiently wait. Or perhaps you see it is possible to turn right on Martini and so you do. You find an alternate exit via Martini to Rannells. Here is where crossing guards do us no good. Rannells backs up now with no QT because parents like me drop their children off at the MS or HS and we exit via Martini to Rannells. Now we have a percentage of those 194 trips travelling north with the school drop off traffic. Crossing guards will not protect those people now stuck waiting for the Rannells light nor will it help the dozen or so home owners whose garages line Martini. They will be trying to back out in the AM to go to work. Ask them how they feel about it. I have, almost every one of them. And no one there I talked to likes the additional Martini traffic.

Keith - Even though your attitude is a bit rough towards the 'naysayers' here, you are closer to them than you think. People aren't out to veto the QT move outright, but rather want the City Council to actually review the proposal, pay close attention to a complete traffic study, and then make the changes needed to ensure that this QT location is NOT a safety nightmare or eyesore. We need to hold our elected officials to a high standard and make sure they listen to concerns before rubber stamping anything. Your idea about making it one way? That's an idea, one of hopefully many they consider. QT's offer of a crossing guard is not a real idea.

Ian is right. We are not that far off from each other. Keith, you offer one of many creative solutions that might meet the safety concerns of Maplewood's citizens. Your creativity is all I am seeking from city leaders. Leadership and creative solutions. Before we took up the petition effort they were ready to give this plan carte blanche approval based upon an incomplete traffic estimate paid for by QT. There is a safe way to develop that property but so far it has not been created and I will fight with respect and civility with all my heart and soul until I feel it is safe.

Some very interesting stats regarding student traffic flow at the corner of Big Bend and Manchester Rd this morning (8/15 - starting at 7:17am);
19 students crossed Big Bend ( White Castle to Scooter store).
2 students crossed Manchester Rd (Shell Station to Scooter store).
15 students crossed Manchester Rd down by the Jack in the Box - this was in the middle of the street - against heavy flow of traffic.

Many of the 19 students (appeared to be Jr.-Hi) crossing from White Castle were on bikes and all used the crosswalk and electric signal. They were very responsible and looked for traffic.

Also, there was no "Crossing Guard" at this intersection - I had thought the School District was going to place someone there. Especially after last nights comments by the School Board that this was a dangerous intersection!!
Kinda makes be wonder.

Thanks Bob for making the observations and sharing them here. I'm sure the school and parents will want to know that a crossing guard was not present. "It takes a village" so I will make sure this gets brought to the school's attention.

Bob's stats appear to make a point: this is simply not as big a deal as many are making it out to be. My guess is that if QT doesn't go there, McDonalds will be next in line.

I have listened to both sides of this argument for some time now and here is the problem...not once have QT and the School Board sat down TOGETHER and try to come up with a plan that suits both parties. Both sides should do this and not leave the meeting until it's done.

I just deleted two of my posts that pertained to the way I felt about Alan Renner's performance at the P&Z meeting. I did not resort to name calling or call anyone a liar. But I did say that he was not truthful and I stand behind that. I delete them not because they were not true or that I regret posting them. But they were focused on the past and for a a moment I dwelt there. I have strong feelings about how he handled some things that night. But I realize I must move forward and not dwell in the past. To those that hold hope in the school board/parents and QT finding it in the "better angels of their nature" to negotiate I wanted to speak that I was not so hopeful considering what I witnessed at the P&Z meeting. Perhaps I ignored my own better angels, not by my posts but by dwelling in the past. I stand by what I said and deleted not because it was not truthful. But because it does not move us forward.

I too was courious to know if QT and the School Board had met since the P&Z meeting. There were not changes to QT's drawings so I wondered if any progress had been made. I spoke with QT's lawyer, John King, after Tuesday's meeting. He told me that he had met with the School Board. It was his opinion that some of the changes QT offered are now being re-considered by the Board. He did not elaborate further. At this point I'm glad to know that they are talking.

This morning I went to the Manchester-Big Bend intersection to count kids crossing to MRH, and Bob Harsh was already there, so we chatted and he kept count. Here are his numbers for the 2nd day of school. They're up from yesterday.
27 students crossed Big Bend ( White Castle to Scooter store).
13 students crossed Manchester Rd (Shell Station to Scooter store).
11 students crossed Manchester Rd down by the Jack in the Box - this was in the middle of the street - against heavy flow of traffic.
A crossing guard (MRH employee, Bob recognized him) got there at 7:13 and stayed until 8:00.

Nancy and others, I spoke to Maria Langston, MRH BOE President, today to get from her what meetings had taken place. Maria did not have her planner in front of her so I do not have exact dates. Here is a summary of those meetings. The board has met with QT staff twice and their attorney once. Once in the late winter where QT presented to the entire board their plans for the site. The second meeting was with three board members, Karen Hall the superintendent, Marty Corcoran, city manager and Mayor White. This was a breakfast meeting and it occurred in the weeks prior to the P&Z meeting. The week after the P&Z meeting three board members and Karen Hall were asked to meet with John King, QT's attorney. At that meeting the board gave their requests to Mr. King. They requested that QT provide a more through traffic audit and that their proposal be altered to not include Martini access. In a letter written by Mr. King to the Board he gave QT's reply which was in essence that they felt their proposal was safe and that no alterations would be made. There have been no other meetings since.

Jeff: Thanks for the up-date.

It is very interesting that in two mornings 36 kids blatantly broke the rules and crossed in the middle of Manchester during one of the busiest times of the day. If they get hit the fault will rest completely with the masses of texting, hotzie eating, coffee drinking drivers....

Also interesting is that even with all of the talk concerning children's safety it took a comment from a Patch poster to get a crossing guard out there.

Me thinks someone has a little urban chicken egg on their face...

One more thing, I was not able to attend the meeting on Tuesday but were the sheeple really pointing their fingers at the council and saying they would blame THEM if their children were hit by a car? Really?!

Regardless of what happens, I think I'll keep buying gas at U Gas on Hanley where I get a 5-cent cash discount.

If this whole deal falls through, what is QT going to do? I'm concerned they might leave Maplewood, which I wouldn't want to see happen.

To the comments that seem to be accusing the school for negligence in not currently having a crossing guard, do you understand that the issue isn't just the intersection as it stands but how it will be AFTER putting in a CVS and a QT. Both of those retailers attract many more cars per day than the Scooter shop or Car lot. This is the crux of the matter, and why a large number of people simply want the Council and QT to hold serious discussions about the best way to handle this project. Can Martini be closed off to northbound traffic? Can Martini be diverted across the top of the QT lot to come out at a light on Big Bend? Can Martini be made one way? There is so much to discuss, and the proposal as it currently stands does not really address a lot of the concerns.

I didn't read all the comments, so if this has already been mentioned, I apologize. Has anyone thought of adding an additional crosswalks, where the kids would cross only one road at a time and not at the busy intersection. They could cross Manchester, maybe by the city hall, where there is already a cross walk. A second cross walk could be across Big Bend closer to the school itself. As a person who lives in this area, I see kids ALL day long crossing not in the cross walk, across all the lanes of traffic at Manchester, and the cross walk is just feet away from them. There are ways to make this work, but the kids must take responsibilty also for crossing safely. If children will not follow the rules of the road, maybe they are not ready to walk to and fro from school.
As far as the young man who was hit at the cross walk. That must have been very scary for the child, the parents, and the driver. I am glad to hear that he is ok.